“But there was a grand jury hearing on this case,” Wilds said, “and I have an idea who might have [called] based on that hearing.”, Despite Wilds’ certainty, not everyone is convinced. Because at the time I was convinced that I would be going to jail for a long time if he turned me in for drug dealing, especially to high school kids. I asked him where we’re going and he says, ‘Didn’t you say everyone gets dumped in Leakin Park?’. And the other thing about it, I mean, there looked like there was real hurt and pain. Send us a tip using our anonymous form. It was at least a week before she died, when he found out she was either cheating on him or leaving him. It wasn’t just like I was selling a nickel bag here and there. People had lives and were trying to get into college and stuff like that. The other thing to understand is something about the culture of Baltimore—this is where the ‘Stop Snitching’ video comes from. He first claimed Syed told Wilds to meet him in a “strip”, then he later switched his … Then what happens, and what time is it roughly? I know it didn’t happen anywhere other than my grandmother’s house. One witness, Jay Wilds, claimed he helped Syed transport and bury Lee's body. But she seemed to be more mature, like she was two, three, four years older than us. The interview is just the first installment of a multi-part series, and covers the basics of the case, Wilds’ motivation for helping Syed allegedly bury Lee’s body and his account of what happened on January 13th, 1999, the day she was murdered. In that situation, he was the loser. Yes. So I said, ‘Look man, I’m not touching [Hae]. As the documentary details, DNA samples did not produce positive results for Syed’s DNA in Hae’s cars, where police believe she was killed. He just couldn’t come to grips with those feelings. It’s in the evening after school, we never hung out in the morning. Jay chose not to be formally interviewed by either “This American Life” or by “Serial” host and producer, Sarah Koenig. He failed; he lost the girl. Why did you agree to help Adnan bury Hae? I had cops show up and harass me before at my house. The pandemic, police violence, and more guns all contributed to an unprecedented rise in murders across the United States. I believe she had a job also. For our age group, she was really independent. Still, Wilds remembers Syed being very distraught after he and Lee broke up and she began seeing another guy. Syed had motive to kill because he was possessive during their relationship and angry that … It wasn’t like, ‘Oh, we’re down in the park, come on down.’ We were friendly, we were cool. “They had to chase me around before they could corner me to talk to me, and there came a point where I was just sick of talking to them. She looked kinda purple, blue, her legs were tucked behind her, she had stockings on, none of her clothes were removed, nothing like that. He said, ‘I’m gonna drive back down there [to the grave]. He calls me and says ‘I’m outside,’ so I come outside to talk to him and followed him to a different car, not his. He knew I was afraid of that. And I found that to be a bit of a slap in the face. I said, ‘Drug dealers, people who get killed by drug dealers,’ and I’m thinking to myself, ‘When did I ever say that?’ So, as I’m riding with him to the park and it starts raining and I’m thinking to myself as he pulls over—and I’m thinking this is the spot he’s chosen. I said, ‘Isn’t he a paramedic?’ And she said, ‘Nah, he’s cool, plus he wants to buy.’, I didn’t trust him at first, since he wasn’t like the people I knew — pot smokers you know? What do you think? You’re in this on your own. Football paid for everything at the school. One such person was Jennifer Pusateri, who had a vital interaction with Syed and alleged accomplice Jay Wilds on Jan. 13, 1999, the night Lee, a high school student in Baltimore, was murdered. I thought at worst he’d throw a rock through her window or something. You can’t start drawing conclusions like that. I also ran the operation out of my grandmother’s house and that also put my family at risk. Who would hold party elites accountable to the values they proclaim to have? Jay Wilds testimony begins – p12 Jay Wilds leaves the courtroom – p86 Jay Wilds, … Stephanie [Jay’s girlfriend] came to me and said ‘Adnan is pretty cool,’ plus he wanted to buy some weed. Like Koenig reported, Wilds and Syed were never close friends — classmates and smoking buddies at most. The pair parted ways for several hours, and Wilds eventually picked up Syed from the Best Buy parking. In his full written opinion, Welch noted that Jay Wilds’s testimony was inconsistent with the State’s version of events, and that Gutierrez … Jay … But their gym, lockers, parking, was down in the magnet wing. What else could motivate you to choke the life out of someone you cared about? Hae’s car could have been in the parking lot, but I didn’t know what it looked like so I don’t remember. Though Koenig never formally interviewed Wilds, she did track him down and confront him off the record; Wilds eventually declined to be interviewed for the show. note: Adnan worked as an emergency medical technician, not a paramedic.]. I was also running [drug] operations from my grandmother’s house. If Kristi did have the date wrong, then this could poke a hole in Jay's testimony and the phone evidence. No — until they told me they weren’t trying to prosecute me for selling weed, or trying to get any of my friends in trouble. I’m not a lawyer and I’m not a cop. I met him while I was still at Woodlawn, so around 1998. The way she moved and went about her day. But he didn’t call me unless he needed something. But when they put the magnet wing in, it was kinda like ‘these people were different from us.’ And they didn’t have to interact with us anymore. Jay’s testimony was critical to the state’s case; indeed, without his testimony it’s virtually impossible that the state could have even brought Syed to trial. When Woodlawn put in the magnet thing, they took out all the vocational classes. A big part of the ‘Serial’ podcast is to speculate on Adnan’s motive. and 4p.m. As for his account of what happened on January 13th, Wilds said Syed did not mention any plans to murder Lee when he loaned him his car and cellphone. No. Wherever her car was at the time I picked him up from Best Buy, it probably stayed there until he picked me up later that evening. I don’t know what happened, what occurred between them that day. Joining is simple and doesn’t need to cost a lot: You can become a sustaining member for as little as $3 or $5 a month. Yes. Take my car, take my cellphone. In “Serial” you are depicted as a petty weed dealer. They can’t do something to better their situation at all.”. Wilds was the star witness for the prosecution, and claimed in court that he helped Syed dispose of Lee's body. Syed had been convicted after a witness, Jay Wilds, said he helped Syed bury her body. In February of 2000, Syed was found guilty of murdering Lee. I told [Adnan] that I wouldn’t touch her car, or any of her possessions, and I say, ‘Fuck it. Adnan left and then returned to my house several hours later, closer to midnight in his own car. I knew him because I knew Muslims in the community from playing basketball at the mosque. Then he calls me and says, ‘Come pick me up.’, So I go to pick him up, and when I get there he says, ‘Oh shit, I did it.’ I say, ‘Did what?’ He says, ‘I killed Hae.’. I pick him up — he doesn’t have any car with him. Is that why you didn’t initially cooperate with the police? However he ended up doing it — whether it was premeditated, an involuntary reaction at that point in time — he just couldn’t come to grips with being a loser and failing. He came back with no tools or anything. No — until they told me they weren’t trying to prosecute me for selling weed, or trying to get any of my friends in trouble. Yeah. And at a certain point I say, ‘Well fuck, I’m finished. But look, if we start speculating what he was thinking that far ahead – I don’t know. Lee’s ex-boyfriend, Adnan Syed, 17, became the primary suspect in her homicide after an anonymous caller told the police to investigate him. He just started opening up. © Copyright 2021 Rolling Stone, LLC, a subsidiary of Penske Business Media, LLC. “I didn’t tell the cops it was in front of my house because I didn’t want to involve my grandmother. ‘Framing Britney Spears:’ How to Watch the New Britney Spears Documentary on Hulu for Free, Peter Tosh Master Tape Rediscovered in ‘Studio 17’ Doc Clip, Hear the Trailer for Connie Walker’s New True-Crime Podcast ‘Stolen: The Search for Jermain’, Kim Kardashian Files for Divorce From Kanye West, A Teenage Superhero Comes Into His Own in the Trailer for Robert Kirkman’s ‘Invincible’. I’m fucking done.’ And Adnan’s like, ‘Oh, well, you’re not going to help me move her are you?’ And I’m like ‘No, I’m not gonna help you move her.’ He says, ‘Ok, well, I’m gonna need you to drive back to her car.”, Somewhere up around a corner up a hill, parked in a strange neighborhood. What did you know about Adnan and his relationship with Hae Min Lee? And then I would only give them information pertaining to my interaction with someone or where I was. There were some big forces going on that didn’t have anything to do with Hae. It wasn’t until they made it clear they weren’t interested in my ‘procurement’ of pot that I began to open up any. I only smoked with him two or three times. She got a new boyfriend?’ And he didn’t know how to deal with that. I saw her body later, in front of of my grandmother’s house where I was living. And they wouldn’t stop interviewing me or questioning me. Just two nursing home executives have been indicted for Covid-19 deaths, while the industry showered millions on candidates, PACs, and lobbying. I might have sat next to him in a class, and joked or something. I saw the ATF and DEA take down guys in my neighborhood for selling much less than I was at the time. Like she was a junior in college. A. Counter-argument: Jay Wilds’s testimony included a lot of inconsistencies in the story. Pusateri’s police interviews and court testimony (along with Wilds’ own) were instrumental in convicting Syed of the killing. It’s not my job to figure that out. I don’t feel comfortable drawing conclusions like that. We were in the car, we were riding, smoking. Jay’s testimony was critical to … Yes we dig for about 40 minutes and we dig and dig, and he’s digging less and less. That’s the best way I can account for the inconsistencies. How old were you when you first met Adnan Syed? On Jan. 13, 1999, Hae Min Lee, an 18-year-old high school student from Baltimore, went missing. What was your life like during 1998 and 1999? When Adnan was asked about Jay he says, “With Jay, it was more so kinda like — in my mind I was like, “maybe the police are putting him up to this.” (Syed, The Deal with Jay: Serial, 2016, 0:19). But, like I said, I don’t know how to come up with this story about how Adnan did it, why he did it, what he was thinking, how he was thinking, and why he was thinking that. Yes. And people were starting to find out he was a loser, ‘Oh, you and Hae aren’t together anymore. And it was really hard for him to deal with being on the losing end. I know it didn’t happen anywhere other than my grandmother’s house. on about your day, ask yourself: How likely is it that the story you just read would have been produced by a different news outlet if The Intercept hadn’t done it? It wasn’t like, ‘Oh, we’re going bowling, and let’s call it in before we go bowling and call the rest of our friends and call Jay.’ I don’t remember ever going to any kinds of functions or endeavors together, or any concerts or clubs together, you know. By using that approach to Jay’s testimony, it is possible to invent a narrative that supports the guilt of just about any individual connected to Woodlawn. He seemed under a lot of pressure to please. But there was a grand jury hearing on this case, and I have an idea who might have based on that hearing. She just seemed like an older chick who happened to be in high school. An example of one of the major changes is where he saw the murder. HBO. I don’t necessarily know if he meant to kill Hae before he did it or if it was a sudden moment thing, but looking at his life, from what I saw, he seemed to be far out of his realm when it came to Hae leaving him. https://www.digitalspy.com/tv/ustv/a26794418/jay-wilds-now-adnan-syed-serial Let’s back up, tell me what happened when you arrived at the Best Buy to pick up Adnan. I don’t know if she said something he couldn’t handle, and he went off the edge or if he had been seriously speculating about it. In Wilds testimony he portrayed Syed as a cold blooded killer that he had to meet with and help to hide Lee’s body. This is the first part in a multipart interview. He says, ‘OK, follow me halfway back down the hill [towards the grave site],” so he doesn’t have to walk all the way back up the hill to get back to me in his car. Jay Wilds, the key witness in the Serial murder case, has broken his silence at last. I think — and, look, it’s been 15 years — about 6 p.m. I guess I was being kind of a jury on whether or not people needed to be involved or whatever, but these people didn’t have anything to do with it, and I knew they didn’t have anything to do with it. From your perspective, what was Adnan’s reputation at Woodlawn? We got in his car and start driving. He never said anything like, ‘Hey, what gauge gun should I use?’ or ‘How many minutes am I supposed to hold somebody under the water for?’ or, ‘Is there a statute of limitation on murder?’ I thought he was just blowing off steam and bullshitting. We’re sitting there smoking and he receives a phone call from the police and gets all panicky. Wilds recalled the moment a week before the murder when Syed told him he was going to kill Lee, but said he still wasn’t sure if Syed was just blowing off steam or, according to him, if the murder was pre-meditated. I don’t know. We get into his car, and he drives up around the corner to Hae’s car. There aren't any updates about Jay Wilds in 2019, ... a detailed breakdown of the timeline of the day of murder according to Wilds' two police interviews and testimony is provided. I had never known anybody who had killed anybody else, so there’s no way I could have known. Syed’s trial, and Jay’s testimony, became the focus of a “This American Life” spinoff series, the 12-part podcast “Serial,” broadcast in the fall of this year. He said, ‘You’ve gotta help me, or I’m gonna tell the cops about you and the weed and all that shit.’ And then he popped the trunk and I saw Hae’s body. I know that he came from a very strict religious background and that he was uneasy with some of the things he was doing. He was magnet. “What else could motivate you to choke the life out of someone you cared about? How many covert wars, miscarriages of justice, and dystopian technologies would remain hidden if our reporters weren’t on the beat? No. Sign up for our newsletter. I follow him halfway back down the hill, park, smoke some cigarettes. He spoke with The Intercept's Natasha Vargas-Cooper about his version of events on the day Baltimore-area teenager Hae Min Lee was killed in 1999. Syed's classmate Jay Wilds, who said at trial that he helped Syed bury Lee's body, became the central figure in the national conversation over Syed's guilt. He asked me if I had shovels, so I went inside my house and got some gardening tools. Jay Wilds, the key witness in Adnan Syed's trial, gave his first interview in years, and now Rabia Chaudry, the woman who introduced Sarah Koenig to Syed, claims it proves Wilds has been lying the whole time. Why Were There So Many Serial Killers Between 1970 and 2000 — and Where Did They Go? A star witness in the case against Syed was fellow Woodlawn High School student Jay Wilds, ... a key part of which was centered on Wilds’ testimony. I say, ‘Well we need to part ways.’ I don’t remember if he dropped me off at my house or if I got a ride from somebody else. Didn’t say that much. Want more Rolling Stone? Jay Wilds, the key witness detailed in hit podcast Serial, broke his silence in an interview with The Intercept Courtesy of Natasha Cooper-Vargas for The Intercept If … Although Jay Wilds’s testimonies are inconsistent, they are wrongly used to convict Adnan Syed. Wilds's testimony played a giant part in convicting Syed of murdering his high school girlfriend, Hae Min Lee in 1999. Jay Wilds' ex girlfriend. And I said, ‘Hey, I need to run to the mall ’cause I need to get a gift for Stephanie.’, He said then, ‘No, I gotta go do something. Is this when you first saw Hae’s body in the trunk of her car? He just couldn’t come to grips with those feelings. Jay’s wife and mother entertained the couple’s young children while Jay and I spoke in the family living room. That’s about burying her. What Drove the Historically Large Murder Spike in 2020? Got called an Oreo. Just normal conversation like, ‘I think she’s fucking around. Wilds’ testimony has been the subject of many questions over the years. The testimony that Jay Wilds gave was the evidence used to convict Adnan of Hae's murder, despite there being no physical evidence. It takes him about half an hour, 45 minutes, and he comes back with gloves on, panting, like, ‘She was really heavy.’ That’s all he says. That’s all it takes to support the journalism you rely on. I remember the highway traffic to my right, and I remember standing there on the curb. He seemed a little bit more uptight than the other Muslim kids that I knew. Arts & Entertainment; Jay From "Serial" Gave An Interview That Might Actually Help Adnan Syed. There was never a real friendship. When did you two get closer to each other? ... Wilds contradicts the testimony he gave at Syed's second trial … Correction: The original version of this story incorrectly stated that Adnan Syed went to trial in December 2000. I’m pretty sure it was my fear of going to prison for having a bunch of weed in my grandma’s house. I believe I told them it was in front of ‘Cathy’s [not her real name] house, but it was in front of my grandmother’s house. After all, said Chaudry, the only thing the prosecution ever had to convict Syed of the crime was Jay Wilds’ testimony. Cell Phone Tower Records I was pretty distraught, fucked up, feeling guilty for not saying nothing. No. It’s starting to get dark, so between 3p.m. Where was Hae’s car? Once the police made it clear that my drug dealing wasn’t gonna affect the outcome of what was going on, I became a little bit more transparent. When I pick him up at Best Buy, he’s telling me her car is somewhere there, and that he did this in the parking lot. I don’t know whether he calls me when he’s on his way back to my house, or if he calls me right outside the house. They can’t escape this. Getting them in trouble for anything that they knew or that I had told them — I couldn’t have that. I really didn’t know much about their relationship, if they hung out, where they hung out, when they hung out. Ok, so you arrive at Cathy’s with Adnan after he tells you he murdered Hae? Wilds never spoke on tape with Serial 's host, Sarah Koenig, but after the podcast's final episode, he granted an interview to The Intercept, published in three parts last week. I don’t think that’s wrong, it’s high school, you know. “[T]here looked like there was real hurt and pain,” Wilds said of Syed. We were in the car together during last period—he was ditching the last period. Wilds maintains that Syed threatened to turn him over to the police for drug-dealing if he didn’t help bury Lee’s body; and, his own fear of going to jail, or implicating his friends or family, is what kept him from contacting authorities before the two buried the body in Leakin Park. The star witness at Syed’s trial was Jay Wilds, a former classmate who testified that he helped Syed dispose of Lee’s body. I stonewalled them that way. The kind of reporting we do is essential to democracy, but it is not easy, cheap, or profitable. People had lives and were trying to get into college and stuff like that. It went national, but it was produced in Baltimore. Biden Declares Major Disaster to Provide More Aid to Texas, Michelle Wie West Responds to Rudy Giuliani’s Reprehensible Remarks About Her, Rick Livingstone on How He Came to Front Rock’s Shortest-Lived Supergroup. I didn’t resent the students, I resented the school for setting it up like that. I’m gonna kill that bitch, man.’ Nothing real pointed or anything, not like, ‘I know his name,’ or ‘I caught her.’ But I just thought he was just shooting off like everyone else shoots off when they’re mad at their girlfriend. When was the first time you hung out with Adnan? Jay feels strongly that he was unfairly depicted by Koenig and that she painted a highly misleading portrayal of him and his role in the case. Like, he’s not in a car or anything. Before you would just go down there for drafting, shop, and everyone would co-mingle, and all the students interacted. In the podcast Koenig pointedly challenged Jay’s account of events and his motivation for assisting Adnan. He just seemed like someone who didn’t smoke weed too much. This is where people would have their house firebombed and still tell the police they knew nothing about it rather than to try to make some sense of what’s going on. I had a lot more on the line than just a few bags of weed. And they were getting sentenced to three and five years. I remember Adnan standing next to me. A December 1999 trial ended in mistrial. Syed is currently serving a life sentence. They’re gonna pin me to the fucking wall. The following has been edited and condensed for clarity. We met over the weekend at his two-story suburban home. I wasn’t fully cooperating, so if they said, ‘Well, we have on phone records that you talked to Jenn.’ I’d say, ‘Nope, I didn’t talk to Jenn.’ Until Jenn told me that she talked with the cops and that it was ok if I did too. I’m also thinking, ‘What’s making him think I’m totally okay with this?’ Like if a car goes by, and I jump out and wave at them saying, ‘Hey, this is a murderer right here.’ But I didn’t. The Intercept is a First Look Media Company. When did he first talk to you about hurting her? Never really a big group of friends. They didn’t have to go by us, except to come to lunch, and that was it. It doesn’t seem like enough of a reason to not talk to the police. Jay Wilds, the key witness in the case against Adnan Syed — the man convicted of killing his ex-girlfriend Hae Min Lee in 1999 — has given his first public interview to The Intercept following the popular podcast, “Serial,” which reexamined the murder and subsequent trial. I didn’t know that he planned to murder her that day. By the time I graduated [Woodlawn] high school in 1998, I wasn’t exactly angry, but I did resent the school. Jay gave two interviews, as demonstrated in the podcast, and each time we heard something different. Jay Wilds, the key witness in the case against Adnan Syed — the man convicted of killing his ex-girlfriend Hae Min Lee in 1999 — has given his first public interview to … Adnan says, ‘Just help me dig the hole.’ And I’m still thinking, ‘Inner-city black guy, selling pot to high school kids.’ The cops are going to fry me. I remember Adnan standing next to me.”. Well first of all, I wasn’t openly willing to cooperate with the police. I was a bit of an outdoorsman, adventure seeker, fishing, camping, learned to ride a motorcycle. I played lacrosse, was a bit of a jock. I think there was another dude or something, or whatever. He failed; he lost the girl.”. However he ended up doing it—whether it was premeditated, an involuntary reaction at that point in time—he just couldn’t come to grips with being a loser and failing. I’ll help you dig the hole.’. Cathy has people over when we get there. Whether or not this should be used to convey Adnan Syed, The court is missing one important factor. I don’t think it meant that much to her. I got the feeling the few times of interacting with Adnan that there was this enormous pressure from somewhere trying to make him into something he didn’t want to be. But that, according to what I learned later, is probably not what happened. We don’t have ads, so we depend on our members — 35,000 and counting — to help us hold the powerful to account. Syed was actually convicted in February 2000. When we were digging the hole, it’s not like Hae’s body was just lying next to us. And that’s not necessarily me—but that is my family, that is my uncles and cousins. I remember the highway traffic to my right, and I remember standing there on the curb. They had to chase me around before they could corner me to talk to me, and there came a point where I was just sick of talking to them. I had friends but the groups were small. This interview is the first time Jay has spoken publicly about events surrounding Lee’s death and the trial that ended in Syed’s conviction. “I saw her body later, in front of of my grandmother’s house where I was living,” he said. You follow me some of the way, and then I’ll take care of it.’. COMING NEXT: PART 2, Jay’s theory on the anonymous caller, why he agreed to testify in the state’s case against Adnan, and how “Serial” showed up at his front door. I said, ‘Alright, cool.’ I dropped him off at school, went to the mall, then when I was done, I go back to my friend Jenn’s house, where I normally go, sit and smoke with my friend. But that doesn’t change the fact that the state’s evidence was based entirely on the uncorroborated testimony of a self-acknowledged liar with a motive to falsely incriminate Adnan. “These women — they’re trapped. Wilds also testified that Syed told him that he intended on killing Lee. Because I knew football had paid for all of that, but there were few football players down there. She didn’t look beat up. This is where it was produced. I’m being manipulated into what’s being done right now.’. We want to hear from you! And while this is when Wilds says Syed told him he had killed Lee, it was not when Wilds first saw her body in the trunk of her car. So that would ruin her life too. Jay Wilds, the main witness in a case that put then-18-year-old Adnan Syed into jail for the murder of his ex girlfriend Hae Min Lee in 1999, has done an interview with The Intercept and changed his story. Noble 3 While Jay Wilds was the State’s star witness in this case, his testimony and both interviews were inconsistent. He left in his car and  I was trying to collect myself at my [grandmother’s] house. While “Serial” host and producer Sarah Koenig spent the podcast’s 12-episode run dismantling various aspects of the State’s flimsy case against Syed, she honed in on Wilds, questioning the inconsistencies of his police interviews and trial testimony. The Intercept is an independent nonprofit news outlet. Consider what the world of media would look like without The Intercept. She’s a high school girl, ‘Oh, he’s cute, Oh, whatever’—things fizzle out. Why is this story different from what you originally told the police?
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